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I've seen in news that there are more riots in Paris. Is it now safe to come to Paris?

I'm visiting Paris in december and I've been asking myself that same question. I still think that we shouldn't panic for it's happening in the suburbs, however it's spreading...
I don't think I'll cancel my trip. you?

Riots in Paris Suburbs Continue for 8th Night, Spread

Nov. 4 (Bloomberg) -- Gangs burned cars and took on police for the eighth consecutive night in the Paris suburbs and riots spread to the provinces as the government of Prime Minister Dominique de Villepin struggled to restore calm.

About 240 cars were torched in the northeastern and western suburbs of Paris; 27 buses were set on fire in a depot southwest of the city, local officials said. The number of cars destroyed last night totaled 400, including vehicles in the Burgundy city of Dijon and in the south, Agence France-Presse reported.

``There are now copycat actions and imitations,'' said Eric Raoult, the mayor of Raincy, a town east of Paris. Seine-Saint- Denis, where the riots started, ``is a poor region. People need to find jobs, but it's difficult when your name is Soraya or Kamel,'' Raoult, a member of President Jacques Chirac's Union for a Popular Movement party, said in an interview.

The violence reflects tensions in French ghettos marked by youth unemployment of more than 30 percent, poverty and large immigrant Muslim communities in the majority Catholic nation. De Villepin yesterday vowed before the Senate that authorities ``will not give in'' to the violence and will make restoring order the government's top priority. ``I will not allow organized gangs to lay down the law in the suburbs,'' he said.

Electrocution

The first riots erupted after two boys, aged 15 and 19, one of Tunisian origin, the other from sub-Saharan Africa, were electrocuted on Oct. 27 by high-voltage equipment in an electricity substation, where they took refuge because they were being pursued by police, their families said. The police denied there was any pursuit. The public prosecutor's office said it has opened an investigation into the case.

``Contrary to preceding nights, direct clashes with the police remained few and there was no shooting with real bullets,'' Jean-Francois Cordet, prefect for the Seine-Saint- Denis region, said in an e-mailed statement today. Fewer big gangs and more smaller groups were involved, he said.

In Aulnay-sous-Bois, things were calmer last night, a city hall spokesman said. He said a carpet warehouse was burned in an industrial zone. Town authorities are organizing a march tomorrow to protest the violence, he said.

Source: http://www.bloomberg.com

These people act like they are crazy!
Do they have any demands at least? What is the goal of their riot?

neshka wrote:I'm visiting Paris in december and I've been asking myself that same question. I still think that we shouldn't panic for it's happening in the suburbs, however it's spreading...
I don't think I'll cancel my trip. you?

I think I would prefer to wait, I've seen on news that gangs robbed one bus and all peoples in it, there were tourists from Russia going to Disneyland. Also they sat fire to another bus, so until I will see that authorities will take everything under control I will not visit Paris.

I'm a regular traveler to Pars and definately would not go until these horrible riots are over. The news from last night 3/11 was even worse. It could spred to anywhere in the city.

It's horrible!
I never thought this could happen in France, not to mention Paris!

I know Paris and the northeastern suburbs quite well. Paris is safe and will remain so. The only difficulty tourists may encounter is getting to-from Charles de Gaulle airport. I've heard that train service between the city and CDG has been suspended so don't count on taking the train.

Take a car or the Paris shuttle that drops you off at the Arc du Triompe. Most flights from the U.S. arrive in the morning and the riots are happening at night. Remember that tourism is France's #1 industry. They'll do everything they can to make sure tourists can get from the airports to the city, even in the face of these riots.

They'll do everything they can to make sure tourists can get from the airports to the city, even in the face of these riots.

But I heard that it already happened and there are a lot of tourists from europe that come by busses and cars.
I wouldn't travel to Paris on my personal car.

I am currently living near the affected areas. At present the heart of Paris is really not effected, so visitors are not threatened.
The beef these people have is not with the visitors. It is with the French society. I have visited other european countries and lived in both Canada and the US, the conditions that these people are forced to live in are deplorable for a member of the G-8.

There tactics may seem violent, but from what I can tell it is solely property damage. No one is being hurt accept by the police. (I don't know what lies they are telling you in the USA, but no injuries have been reported here).

This is akin to America's blacks fighting for equal rights. These people are prejudiced against on a daily basis, and those fight now are French citizens, born here, but with names, colours and heritage that is not the same as the "VRAI" francais.

I am white and french speaking, but I am signicantly taller than the average french person, I speak with an accent, and I come from another country. Living here I experience prejudice almost everyday. I cannot imagine how diffucult it must be for those born here that see it continue on a larger scale because they wear the dressings of a muslim, have dark skin or a foreign name. But I do know for a fact that it is a reality.

How bad is anyone's guess, but the BBC has some interesting related articles if anyone is interested.

Ultimately, it is your decision. But don't stay more than two weeks if you do come, after the two week mark, the true colors become more evident.

Kelly

Kelly wrote:[skip]
I am white and french speaking, but I am signicantly taller than the average french person, I speak with an accent, and I come from another country. Living here I experience prejudice almost everyday.

But what prejudice you experience?

I cannot imagine how diffucult it must be for those born here that see it continue on a larger scale because they wear the dressings of a muslim, have dark skin or a foreign name. But I do know for a fact that it is a reality.

How bad is anyone's guess, but the BBC has some interesting related articles if anyone is interested.
Kelly

Can you please point to links of those articles?

Here is a qoute:

I teach in those suburbs and I can tell everyone it's a "hell". These groups often identify themselves to Palestinians and they are under no control. They are gangsters but at the same time they claim to be "good muslims". They fear no one for they are ruling the area where they live. People fear them and the police never come in those places.

Does anyone know why they cannot stop these riots? It seems they have the right idea by massing policemen and arresting people by the hundreds, but the riots seem to be growing. I just can't imagine how a bunch of kids could cause so much trouble. Once they get the military involved the riots should stop. I think that is how they stopped the riots in LA.

I have relatives who live between Montpellier and Nimes. Is everything quiet in this region? The news (in the UK) seems to give conflicting reports on other areas of rioting.

I also have friends in Nantes and I heard there were riots in Rennes - is this true?

On the question of safety in France, there's a sad truth that must be faced. All Muslim countries are violent and intolerant. France is (sadly) crossing a critical threshold where it may now be considered the Islam of Europe. In other words, a stronghold of violence, intolerance, and third world values.

Kelly wrote:I am currently living near the affected areas. At present the heart of Paris is really not effected, so visitors are not threatened.
The beef these people have is not with the visitors. It is with the French society. I have visited other european countries and lived in both Canada and the US, the conditions that these people are forced to live in are deplorable for a member of the G-8.

There tactics may seem violent, but from what I can tell it is solely property damage. No one is being hurt accept by the police. (I don't know what lies they are telling you in the USA, but no injuries have been reported here).

This is akin to America's blacks fighting for equal rights. These people are prejudiced against on a daily basis, and those fight now are French citizens, born here, but with names, colours and heritage that is not the same as the "VRAI" francais.

I am white and french speaking, but I am signicantly taller than the average french person, I speak with an accent, and I come from another country. Living here I experience prejudice almost everyday. I cannot imagine how diffucult it must be for those born here that see it continue on a larger scale because they wear the dressings of a muslim, have dark skin or a foreign name. But I do know for a fact that it is a reality.

How bad is anyone's guess, but the BBC has some interesting related articles if anyone is interested.

Ultimately, it is your decision. But don't stay more than two weeks if you do come, after the two week mark, the true colors become more evident.

Kelly

I'd say your whole attitude sums up why this is happening in France right now.Criminals riot and because they are not white you make up all kind of pathetic excuses for them.People like you are like lambs being fed to the lions.

I live in England but my husband is from Paris and we've spoken to our family there tonight. Where they live its not affected, but they said that its teenagers between 13 and 17 in organized gangs that are rioting in the early hours of the morning. They are vandalizing anything that they can get their hands on even their neighbours cars or belongings, these are kids that are totally out of control. What are their parents doing! never mind the police!

Gauloise wrote: The biggest culprits are all those politicians who have brought into my beautiful country all these hordes of non-European immigrants. The true goal of this immigration is to replace the native French population who has a low birth rate by all these blacks and Muslims. This has nothing to do with unemployment and poverty; it is blackmail, an attempt to gain more power against the French and turn the country, my country into a dump for the Third World. White peoples are on their way to extinction if things go on like this. We cannot compete with big families from outside Europe coming here to reproduce like rabbits. I blame all the so-called mainstream politicians in the Western world for orchestrating the massive arrival of foreigners we never wanted in the first place; the white race ("European") is not reproducing itself. Look at Canadians and Americans: their countries are based on the destruction of Native Peoples. Multiculturalism is a destructive idea: it means less and less for the natives. These politicians have all pursued this madness, they have an agenda: the extermination of the old Celtic tribes native to Europe. France should be for the French, Iraq for the Iraqis, etc... Population replacement, a WHITE genocide is happening all over the Western world. Do White peoples have enough guts to defend their countries? We have hair and eye colours no other race has. It does not mean superiority, it means we are more "fragile". Yes, it is a race issue, I mean, will the Europeans everywhere in the world survive this demographic aggression of unprecedented scale? Blame the politicians who made it easier and easier to migrate into the belly of Europe, blame the voters for not seeing the truth. I am unemployed and I do not burn cars. I offer my sympathy to my suffering compatriots. You can contact me: tellthetruthtoeveryone@yahoo.com

Everything you say is true my friend.But expect a tirade of abuse now from some know it all telling you how it's all whiteys fault

Gauloise wrote:WHITE genocide is happening all over the Western world. Do White peoples have enough guts to defend their countries? We have hair and eye colours no other race has.

Why it doesn't happen in Eastern countries like Russia?

... and it hasn't been for years.
The last time I had the misfortune to travel through Paris was back in 1988. I was travelling on the Metro between railway stations in the Centre of Paris, it was crowded in the rush hour, when I was surrounded by a vociferous gang of North African youths. They screamed and spat at me, got louder and more excited, till there were about 30 of them around me. Eventually, fearing for my life, I gave them my money (including my "emergency supply" which I always kept hidden on me when travelling). This seemed to satify them and at the next station, they all alighted from the train and dispersed. Needless to say, no one else in the carriage came to my aid, if fact they all seemed to have moved away to make room for the youths. When I tried to speak to anybody else who had witnessed what had happened, they all just looked away and wouldn't speak to me. (I am English, and only speak a little French.) At my destination I tried to report it, but was just blanked or met with shrugs and smiles. Faced with the choice of trying to spend time and money (of which I now had none of course), or going on to make my travel connection, I chose the later.

Needless to say, I have NEVER been back to France since, and if this is was it was like 17 years ago, what is it like today?

Bear in mind this happened on the Metro in the centre of Paris at the busiest time of the morning! This is what you must be prepared for if you go to Paris!

We have hair and eye colours no other race has. It does not mean superiority, it means we are more "fragile".

Hahaha.
Just speak for yourself, mate.
We is a very broad word my friend.

Is it safe to go to disneyland Paris?

Gauloise wrote: :x Look at Canadians and Americans: their countries are based on the destruction of Native Peoples.

The Americans that you claim "destroyed" native (non-white, or caucasian) peoples were from Europe. I think you are a mental water head.

Why it doesn't happen in Eastern countries like Russia?

To AngloPhone:
It is happening in Eastern Europe including Russia; they have one of the very lowest white birthrates in Europe and the demographic shift is happening there very rapidly as a result. Remember the struggles in the break-away regions in their south and they have suffered terror attacks in Moscow (theatre, metro etc etc), against airliners, and of course the school in Beslan. Remember also the recent break-up of the former Yugoslavia into ethnic states...

WHITE genocide is happening all over the Western world

To Galuoise:

You are absolutely right in all that you say. And as Guest said, now expect the tirade of abuse from those (white included) that want to see an end to western civilisation and those (white especially) who have been conditioned to ready themselves for their own slaugther. I see that "Euro-American?" is the first to oblige with a silly comment, I surprised no-one can do better/worse than "mental water head". The only word in your peice that I might have changed is "fragile". I think I know what you mean - and I don't think you meant "weak".

Everyone, ask yourselves why our politicians seem paralysed and powerless in the face of this lawlessness? It is only a few weeks since we buried more than 50 victims of muslem terror here in London. Which community did the politicians and the media seek to "reassure" in the wake of those atrocities? Why, the muslem community of course. What about some the reassurance for the rest of us I ask? And whose turn will it be next month: Germany, Italy, Sweden...?

At least I see that some communities outside Paris are starting to form their own citizens' defence committees.

On a point of fact, was the first killing not on the very first day of the "trouble" when a photographer was beaten to death in the district? I know he was "only" a white man, so hardly worth reporting, but does he not count? It was said that he was trying to take a picture of a lamp-post. I wonder what could have been so important that they were so desparate to destroy the images...?

But if the media was at all honest, they would be calling this an insurrection or infatada, not "riots".

Hey,

Has anyone read up on Nostrudamus lately, about a revolution in France that spreads throughout Europe.

What maks it worse, is that the rioters are Muslims teenagers!!!!

All they need now is a leader to direct them and you have the start of World War 3

I am flying into Paris a week from Saturday - my wife and our other companions act as if I am the crazy one for suggesting we change our travel plans. I appreciate the information and perspective this forum has provided and will continue to stay tuned.

view_from_here wrote:

Why it doesn't happen in Eastern countries like Russia?

To AngloPhone:
It is happening in Eastern Europe including Russia; they have one of the very lowest white birthrates in Europe and the demographic shift is happening there very rapidly as a result. Remember the struggles in the break-away regions in their south and they have suffered terror attacks in Moscow (theatre, metro etc etc), against airliners, and of course the school in Beslan. Remember also the recent break-up of the former Yugoslavia into ethnic states...

I think in both of your example there is no racial conflict, it's rather national/cultural/religious.

WHITE genocide is happening all over the Western world

To Galuoise:

You are absolutely right in all that you say. And as Guest said, now expect the tirade of abuse from those (white included) that want to see an end to western civilisation and those (white especially) who have been conditioned to ready themselves for their own slaugther.

What do you call "western civilization"? Is it religous thing? Or cultural, technological?

I see that "Euro-American?" is the first to oblige with a silly comment, I surprised no-one can do better/worse than "mental water head". The only word in your peice that I might have changed is "fragile". I think I know what you mean - and I don't think you meant "weak".

Everyone, ask yourselves why our politicians seem paralysed and powerless in the face of this lawlessness?

politicians are too often powerless in the face of a lot of things they must do

It is only a few weeks since we buried more than 50 victims of muslem terror here in London. Which community did the politicians and the media seek to "reassure" in the wake of those atrocities? Why, the muslem community of course. What about some the reassurance for the rest of us I ask? And whose turn will it be next month: Germany, Italy, Sweden...?

At least I see that some communities outside Paris are starting to form their own citizens' defence committees.

Can you please provide a link to these news?

On a point of fact, was the first killing not on the very first day of the "trouble" when a photographer was beaten to death in the district? I know he was "only" a white man, so hardly worth reporting, but does he not count? It was said that he was trying to take a picture of a lamp-post. I wonder what could have been so important that they were so desparate to destroy the images...?

But if the media was at all honest, they would be calling this an insurrection or infatada, not "riots".

I think those rioting were trying hard to not kill anybody.

Chrsitie wrote:Hey,

Has anyone read up on Nostrudamus lately, about a revolution in France that spreads throughout Europe.

What maks it worse, is that the rioters are Muslims teenagers!!!!

All they need now is a leader to direct them and you have the start of World War 3

This is already panic and paranoia... the right thing to do is to change the laws in such a way that all the imigrants that riot loose their citizenship and are deported to countries they have come from.

Jean wrote:

Chrsitie wrote:Hey,

Has anyone read up on Nostrudamus lately, about a revolution in France that spreads throughout Europe.

What maks it worse, is that the rioters are Muslims teenagers!!!!

All they need now is a leader to direct them and you have the start of World War 3

This is already panic and paranoia...

I agree - all those astrological charlatans...

the right thing to do is to change the laws in such a way that all the imigrants that riot loose their citizenship and are deported to countries they have come from.

How do you imagine implementation of such laws? Where you will deport a person who is of mixed origin?

How do you imagine implementation of such laws? Where you will deport a person who is of mixed origin?

I will let him choose the destination himself or roll the dice for him.
At least a percentage will be deported the rest will calm down.

I am sorry this is long. I wanted to be complete so everyone can understand.

Please do not respond or attack if you do not read it all.

VaBank wrote:But what prejudice you experience?

I'm a french Canadian. But not from Montreal or Quebec city. Montreal is 18 hours by car, so my dialect is very different.
I am white, but I am also 1m80 tall. (6ft)... So, I do not look like a standard "true french woman."
As for the prejudice I have experienced.

First the language.
People hear me talk, assume I am not french; 25% ignore me, the rest commence to bark english at me. (I am thankful my mother made me study english)

Second the paperwork.
This is where all immigrants experience the bulk of it.
We are asked to supply answers and proof to all kinds of questions. Fail to fill in a blank and you can not proceed.
It took me 6 months to get a bank account. Some places outright said that it could not be done. Finally an attorney helped make it happen, but not without 8000 euro security and documents from my account in good standing in my home country. I had to prove my money was not "black" and not borrowed, and I cannot touch it again until after the account has been closed.
I am fortunate because Canada is a country where France recognizes the banking system. Many poorer nations do not have this option. But then again, they don't have the money to "secure" the account either.

(But what makes angry is I made friends with a girl from Montreal. She received bank account in 30 minutes. In one of the banks I had already tried. She has a "recognized" accent and dialect and is only 1m55).

Getting an apartment was were I experienced the next prejudice.

People would not rent to me. I would call and the apartment was always Un-available. But when my friend called, immediately afterwards, it was ALWAYS available for viewing. In the end a friend took me around and did the talking, but he says I still pay 50 euro more than I should each month.

It has been worse for my husband who is only half French Canadien. His dialect is Acadien and he does not even have a French last name.

I can list many incidents but fortunately they are more annoying for us than problematic. For a person with dark skin it must be much more difficult. And I have seen them being harrassed or rudely pushed aside on many occassions.I can not image being born here and still having to suffer this.

Do not ever forget that the true French have a way of "not seeing" anything they don't want to see or like. There is no official segregation in France and Rosa Parks wouldn't have made an impact because many of the "vrai Francais, prefer to drive or take a taxi cab.

Can you please point to links of those articles?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4405790.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4399748.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4395934.stm

Gauloise wrote: The biggest culprits are all those politicians who have brought into my beautiful country all these hordes of non-European immigrants. The true goal of this immigration is to replace the native French population who has a low birth rate by all these blacks and Muslims. This has nothing to do with unemployment and poverty; it is blackmail, an attempt to gain more power against the French and turn the country, my country into a dump for the Third World. White peoples are on their way to extinction if things go on like this. We cannot compete with big families from outside Europe coming here to reproduce like rabbits. I blame all the so-called mainstream politicians in the Western world for orchestrating the massive arrival of foreigners we never wanted in the first place; the white race ("European") is not reproducing itself. Look at Canadians and Americans: their countries are based on the destruction of Native Peoples. Multiculturalism is a destructive idea: it means less and less for the natives. These politicians have all pursued this madness, they have an agenda: the extermination of the old Celtic tribes native to Europe. France should be for the French, Iraq for the Iraqis, etc... Population replacement, a WHITE genocide is happening all over the Western world. Do White peoples have enough guts to defend their countries? We have hair and eye colours no other race has. It does not mean superiority, it means we are more "fragile". Yes, it is a race issue, I mean, will the Europeans everywhere in the world survive this demographic aggression of unprecedented scale? Blame the politicians who made it easier and easier to migrate into the belly of Europe, blame the voters for not seeing the truth. I am unemployed and I do not burn cars. I offer my sympathy to my suffering compatriots. You can contact me: tellthetruthtoeveryone@yahoo.com

I like your email address. "Tell the Truth to Everyone."

You see I'm from North America and we tend to not call it the "Truth" but a meeting of the Klu Klux Klan.

I agree with Kelly. The prejudice is just as bad as the violence.
I don't advocate what is happening around Paris, I think there are always ways to resolve problems without setting your own neighborhood on fire. But at the same time the war against people that look or talk " different" is something that any government of any county should be ashamed of.

True: there are gangs that are cruel and violent and they make no distinction whom to kill or still from. Those should be put in jail or persecuted at the full extend of the law. But there are also many immigrants who live in France who are honest and hardworking. All that separates them from their neighbors is the color of their skin or an accent. My girlfriend lives in Paris, she is WHITE, BLOND 164 cm (5'5") but she speaks with an accent, and she has told me the same stories of discrimination and racial profiling.
I also have a friend in US who has been forced to live his job when his boss found out about his Arabic origin. The guy is the most decent and hard working humanbeing I have even met!

The real truth is that every nation and every religion has plenty of violence and dark spots on it's history. You can't judge all by the actions of the lowest scummiest representatives of the culture.

I hope the violence around Paris stops and those who really are oppressed will get better chances to succeed in French society through the new laws and regulations. I also hope that immigration process would become such that France brings only educated and wishing to work people into it's borders. After all, if you want to live in a civilized society, you need to contribute to it not just demand that things are handed to you on a silver plate.

I have little experience with French culture, but I have many French-speaking friends that have told me that Parisians are extremely xenophobic (Afraid of people that are not like them). I think the examples of prejudice because of height and accent? I'm a college student in America and have all kinds of nationalities from every continent except Antarctica. There's a Nigerian on our women's basketball team. One of my best friends is of Indian descent. My first-year roommate was partly Native American.

What is happening right now can be backlash against the prejudice that Parisians have used against immigrants. In physics, Newton's Third Law is to every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. These riots are the reaction. What can the French government do? I believe the curfew is a good idea. I also think that the French people need to take a very long and objective look at their society's attitudes towards immigrants and foreigners.

I also think that this is a wake-up call for other countries to look at their own immigrant populations and how they feel they are being treated. Will riots like these erupt in Germany, Russia, or Italy? Only if they do not learn the lessons that Paris is having burned into it's awareness. It's time for everyone to look at how they treat others and ask themselves if that is how they would like to be treated.

Gauloise, stop trolling for controversy and trouble. If you truly believe that hateful tripe, you need to see a psychiatrist.

Kelly2 wrote:I am sorry this is long. I wanted to be complete so everyone can understand.

Please do not respond or attack if you do not read it all.

VaBank wrote:But what prejudice you experience?

I'm a french Canadian. But not from Montreal or Quebec city. Montreal is 18 hours by car, so my dialect is very different.
I am white, but I am also 1m80 tall. (6ft)... So, I do not look like a standard "true french woman."

But isn't it an advantage rather than disadvantage?

As for the prejudice I have experienced.

First the language.
People hear me talk, assume I am not french; 25% ignore me, the rest commence to bark english at me.

I think it's not because they wish to do discrimination, for me for example it is also difficult to talk with people with unusual accent in my own language and it's not because I don't like those people. Also I experienced same thing - when I was talking in foreign language people often tried to change language because it was difficult to understand me.

(I am thankful my mother made me study english)

Isn't it obligatory in Canada to know 2 languages french and english?

Second the paperwork.
This is where all immigrants experience the bulk of it.
We are asked to supply answers and proof to all kinds of questions. Fail to fill in a blank and you can not proceed.

Do you think that there are few international criminals? If not by paperwork how can a bank protect from them?

It took me 6 months to get a bank account. Some places outright said that it could not be done. Finally an attorney helped make it happen, but not without 8000 euro security and documents from my account in good standing in my home country. I had to prove my money was not "black" and not borrowed, and I cannot touch it again until after the account has been closed.

French bureaucratic system is legendary, but what you want from country which introduced this word?

I am fortunate because Canada is a country where France recognizes the banking system. Many poorer nations do not have this option. But then again, they don't have the money to "secure" the account either.

(But what makes angry is I made friends with a girl from Montreal. She received bank account in 30 minutes. In one of the banks I had already tried. She has a "recognized" accent and dialect and is only 1m55).

Similar thing is in US with credit history, some of my immigrant friends told me that to have credit history you have to return credits and to have those credits to return you have to have credit history and it also is solvable only with big sum of money to place as deposit.

Getting an apartment was were I experienced the next prejudice.

People would not rent to me. I would call and the apartment was always Un-available. But when my friend called, immediately afterwards, it was ALWAYS available for viewing. In the end a friend took me around and did the talking, but he says I still pay 50 euro more than I should each month.

It has been worse for my husband who is only half French Canadien. His dialect is Acadien and he does not even have a French last name.

I can list many incidents but fortunately they are more annoying for us than problematic. For a person with dark skin it must be much more difficult. And I have seen them being harrassed or rudely pushed aside on many occassions.I can not image being born here and still having to suffer this.

I think it's just a difference in culture, may be they think that you are too "American"?

Do not ever forget that the true French have a way of "not seeing" anything they don't want to see or like. There is no official segregation in France and Rosa Parks wouldn't have made an impact because many of the "vrai Francais, prefer to drive or take a taxi cab.

What are Rosa Parks?

VaBank wrote:What are Rosa Parks?

What is bliss?

VaBank wrote:I've seen in news that there are more riots in Paris. Is it now safe to come to Paris?

yes this is a hard topic but france right now the roits are esing and if you don't get into it it will be fine

Kelly2 wrote: You see I'm from North America and we tend to not call it the "Truth" but a meeting of the Klu Klux Klan.[/b]

Woah. I'm not sure how it is in Canada, but in the U.S., people who tell the truth tend to be called liberals, not the KKK. Enough of us are educated to know the difference between vile evil like the KKK as opposed to people who want to start an honest discussion on race and prejudice.

VaBank wrote:

Kelly2 wrote:I am sorry this is long. I wanted to be complete so everyone can understand.

Please do not respond or attack if you do not read it all.

VaBank wrote:But what prejudice you experience?

I'm a french Canadian. But not from Montreal or Quebec city. Montreal is 18 hours by car, so my dialect is very different.
I am white, but I am also 1m80 tall. (6ft)... So, I do not look like a standard "true french woman."

But isn't it an advantage rather than disadvantage?

As for the prejudice I have experienced.

First the language.
People hear me talk, assume I am not french; 25% ignore me, the rest commence to bark english at me.

I think it's not because they wish to do discrimination, for me for example it is also difficult to talk with people with unusual accent in my own language and it's not because I don't like those people. Also I experienced same thing - when I was talking in foreign language people often tried to change language because it was difficult to understand me.

(I am thankful my mother made me study english)

Isn't it obligatory in Canada to know 2 languages french and english?

Second the paperwork.
This is where all immigrants experience the bulk of it.
We are asked to supply answers and proof to all kinds of questions. Fail to fill in a blank and you can not proceed.

Do you think that there are few international criminals? If not by paperwork how can a bank protect from them?

It took me 6 months to get a bank account. Some places outright said that it could not be done. Finally an attorney helped make it happen, but not without 8000 euro security and documents from my account in good standing in my home country. I had to prove my money was not "black" and not borrowed, and I cannot touch it again until after the account has been closed.

French bureaucratic system is legendary, but what you want from country which introduced this word?

I am fortunate because Canada is a country where France recognizes the banking system. Many poorer nations do not have this option. But then again, they don't have the money to "secure" the account either.

(But what makes angry is I made friends with a girl from Montreal. She received bank account in 30 minutes. In one of the banks I had already tried. She has a "recognized" accent and dialect and is only 1m55).

Similar thing is in US with credit history, some of my immigrant friends told me that to have credit history you have to return credits and to have those credits to return you have to have credit history and it also is solvable only with big sum of money to place as deposit.

Getting an apartment was were I experienced the next prejudice.

People would not rent to me. I would call and the apartment was always Un-available. But when my friend called, immediately afterwards, it was ALWAYS available for viewing. In the end a friend took me around and did the talking, but he says I still pay 50 euro more than I should each month.

It has been worse for my husband who is only half French Canadien. His dialect is Acadien and he does not even have a French last name.

I can list many incidents but fortunately they are more annoying for us than problematic. For a person with dark skin it must be much more difficult. And I have seen them being harrassed or rudely pushed aside on many occassions.I can not image being born here and still having to suffer this.

I think it's just a difference in culture, may be they think that you are too "American"?

Do not ever forget that the true French have a way of "not seeing" anything they don't want to see or like. There is no official segregation in France and Rosa Parks wouldn't have made an impact because many of the "vrai Francais, prefer to drive or take a taxi cab.

What are Rosa Parks?

I'm not sure why you are dismissing her opionions. As an American, I'm enlightened to learn that she felt this way in France, even as a French white woman. I wouldn't have imagined that a white female would be treated differently for being too tall or having a different accent -- but she has proof in that her friend (who is apparently not too tall, or obviously foreign) has been treated differently than her, assuming both are equally charming.

Regarding your comment on banking and international criminals -- really now....do you think that explains why it took them 6 months to give her account? Assuming, that Kelly does not have any type of a criminal background? Does this country assume guilt until proven innocent?

Rosa Parks -- she is a remarkable individual who changed American civil rights history by standing up for her rights to enjoy the priviledges of life;same as her fellow (white) Americans -- rights which should have never been taken away in ther first place. She just very recently passed away. It would be worth your time to read up on her a bit.

I ended up on this forum to read up on the latest new on the riots to see if Paris is safe to visit -- but the attitudes expressed in this thread are not making it particularly enticing, regardless of the rioting.

Kelly2 wrote:

Gauloise wrote: The biggest culprits are all those politicians who have brought into my beautiful country all these hordes of non-European immigrants. The true goal of this immigration is to replace the native French population who has a low birth rate by all these blacks and Muslims. This has nothing to do with unemployment and poverty; it is blackmail, an attempt to gain more power against the French and turn the country, my country into a dump for the Third World. White peoples are on their way to extinction if things go on like this. We cannot compete with big families from outside Europe coming here to reproduce like rabbits. I blame all the so-called mainstream politicians in the Western world for orchestrating the massive arrival of foreigners we never wanted in the first place; the white race ("European") is not reproducing itself. Look at Canadians and Americans: their countries are based on the destruction of Native Peoples. Multiculturalism is a destructive idea: it means less and less for the natives. These politicians have all pursued this madness, they have an agenda: the extermination of the old Celtic tribes native to Europe. France should be for the French, Iraq for the Iraqis, etc... Population replacement, a WHITE genocide is happening all over the Western world. Do White peoples have enough guts to defend their countries? We have hair and eye colours no other race has. It does not mean superiority, it means we are more "fragile". Yes, it is a race issue, I mean, will the Europeans everywhere in the world survive this demographic aggression of unprecedented scale? Blame the politicians who made it easier and easier to migrate into the belly of Europe, blame the voters for not seeing the truth. I am unemployed and I do not burn cars. I offer my sympathy to my suffering compatriots. You can contact me: tellthetruthtoeveryone@yahoo.com

I like your email address. "Tell the Truth to Everyone."

You see I'm from North America and we tend to not call it the "Truth" but a meeting of the Klu Klux Klan.

Finally! Someone with some sense who has actually called this tirade for what it is - a load of racist, right wing bullshit. Well said Kelly2.
The people who are rioting are people who were born in France, and have French nationality but are shoved to the sidelines of French society. France simply refuses to accept that these issues exist, as their 'colour blind' policy on national census etc states that you cannot ask someone there ethnic background. Very nice in theory, but it is literally a case of refusing to face up to the fact that France has a large Muslim population, along with other ethnic and religious minorities and if they are rioting, it is not because they are a violent people who enjoying causing criminal damage, but it is in anger at the way they are being treated by French society. It is the only way that they can make themselves heard, as they have absolutely no representation politically, socially etc. I'm not condoning these actions, but you have to sympathise with the sentiment behind it. France cannot keep on ignoring its cultutral diversity by trying to homogenise everyone into being 'French'. In fact, France's cultural diversity is unique, and should be embraced and celebrated, not quashed and ignored. So there.

french do not have kids (only dogs) (contrary to nature behavior)
like most of europeans.
thats why france need people from other countries.
your pride will take you to the dissappearance

I think French people who were born in France are guilty for those riots. They created the atmosphere and the tension.

Deporting a person of foreign origin is not reasonable at all. Every country needs immigrants to fill the job vacancies that are not able to be performed by the locals.